For all you resto druids out there, I’ve been tinkering with my healing style and build. So far, I’m more than excited with the results, so I decided to share it with you guys.
The general idea behind it is: for raids, Eflorescence sucks, revamped Wild Growth and revamped Rejuvenation rocks. Even more for 25’s. It’s just better to have a high reaction rate and enough mana to throw Rejuvenation on peeps who need, coped with Wild Growth smart healing, some regrowths when you have OoC procced and a 1.5 sec Nourish.
With this build: http://www.wowhead.com/talent#0hbhZMZrfzhdcrzkuo I think I achieved it. It focuses primarily in Rejuv. That means all Rejuv talents I can get and all mana talents I can get. With this, I noticed that I only go OoM in really stressfull situations, where I squeeze all the mana I can get to get people health up. Out of those situations, I’m really confortable with my mana, even always tossing Rejuvenation out whenever it’s needed.
One thing to notice, too, is that, having 3 people with rejuvenation, your Nourish goes down to 1.5 sec cast. Wich is the same as Regrowth, but with way less mana spent. Since we usually already have LB on one tank all the time, I’m adding a Rejuv on the tank all the time (this makes Mastery being active almost 100% of the time at the tank) and using at least 2 Rejuv on the raid the most I can. Doing that, I can toss Nourish in whoever else may still need health, wich accounts for around 10k health, criting for around 15k health, for a 1.5 sec cast. Wich is a lot and way more than what your Lolflorescence gets nowadays. I, also, got a nice little addon that is really configurable and warns me when OoC procs, so I can use free Regrowth. I noticed that, with this setup, my hps is way above than what it was and I’m still not going OoM. One last thing to notice: Innervate is not an ******* CD. You should use when 2 situations come up: 1 – you are at or below 75% mana; and, 2 – it’s off the 3 minutes CD. With that, I’m able to use innervate 2 times every fight, even 3 times in some particular fights (Omnitron comes to mind).
There are some talents on that tree that I’m still adjusting to see what works better. For example, Nature’s Ward. I noticed that, in some fights, this little talent is extremely important, like Chimaeron fight. I’m constantly below 50% health at this fight (would say 90% of the time) and having it means 1 less Regrowth I have to toss*, meaning more mana and time to heal whoever needs more and what that talent heals me for is just enough to beat the mechanic. But, out of those fights, it’s not really an important talent, since I’m constantly above 50% health.
The other talent would be Nature’s Swiftness, meaning one more ******* CD. Unfortunately, Healing Touch accounts for only 10% of a tank’s health nowadays, so that talent isn’t as strong as it was before.
I could go for 2/3 Living Seed, but since our crit rating isn’t that great and being crit as random as it is, I don’t see that talent as important as it could be.
Nature’s Cure is mandatory for 10 man and, for 25 man, is good to have. Not mandatory, but I wouldn’t raid without it, even though EJ says you should.
Perseverance is an ok talent. If you take in account that receiving less damage equals free heals, in fights that has heavy aoe spell damage that is unavoidable, that may mean you are getting quite some free heals.
Oh, one last thing, gear: I logged off in my dps set, so you will notice a lot of hit stuff there. But, a general thought on my healing set: int, spirit, haste, mastery. In that order, with crit counting for pretty much nothing. Mastery only comes before haste if you are tank healing more than raid healing or if you are above 2000 and something haste, wich I’m not anyways.
So, what you guys think? Would be nice to get some input, if you can.
*In that fight, in 10 man, we use a setup that has me healing 4 peeps (including myself), the second healer healing another 4 peeps (including himself) and the third healer healing the OT. When I only have 1 out of those 4 peeps to heal, I'll toss a Nourish. When I have more than 1, I'll toss Regrowth.
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It all seems reasonable.
Living seed is kind of pointless without efflorescence. Efflorescence has been a questionable talent, and was made even more so by the Wild Growth Buff (IMO). Remove those 6 points, and there's only so many places to put the others to get to 31 points in the tree. If you say you need Nature's Cure for your raid, I don't see any problem with taking it, especially with the build your working with. Having it there, even as insurance, seems like a better idea then many of the other talent choices.
I was also considering a 1/2 in Nature's Ward myself, if I dropped the Efflorescence points. How are you finding it for other fights? Is 1/2 useful there? I was thinking a lot of times, if I was going to want to put a HoT on myself, I was getting hit more than once anyway, meaning 1/2 would have a good chance to proc.
I really wish we could just put those points in genesis...
Perseverance is an ok talent. If you take in account that receiving less damage equals free heals, in fights that has heavy aoe spell damage that is unavoidable, that may mean you are getting quite some free heals.
That was more or less my understanding of it as well. It's a talent to take for fights with large amounts of unavoidable damage.
Xsarus mentioned an addon or something that was helping him track what % of his healing was benefiting from mastery, making things more mathy, and less guessing.
One of the things that's pretty hard to answer now (in my mind at least) is at what point you should reforge/etc. to reach a HoT break point. I'd love to see some little doodad that took into account your various spell percentages, the % that benefit from mastery, and math it out with how much of what stats you could reforge to haste and still come out ahead. I imagine it'd be hard though, since the final tick on a HoT would be the one that's most likely to over-heal, and that only compounds the complexity.
Living seed is kind of pointless without efflorescence. Efflorescence has been a questionable talent, and was made even more so by the Wild Growth Buff (IMO). Remove those 6 points, and there's only so many places to put the others to get to 31 points in the tree. If you say you need Nature's Cure for your raid, I don't see any problem with taking it, especially with the build your working with. Having it there, even as insurance, seems like a better idea then many of the other talent choices.
I was also considering a 1/2 in Nature's Ward myself, if I dropped the Efflorescence points. How are you finding it for other fights? Is 1/2 useful there? I was thinking a lot of times, if I was going to want to put a HoT on myself, I was getting hit more than once anyway, meaning 1/2 would have a good chance to proc.
I really wish we could just put those points in genesis...
Brisin wrote:
Perseverance is an ok talent. If you take in account that receiving less damage equals free heals, in fights that has heavy aoe spell damage that is unavoidable, that may mean you are getting quite some free heals.
That was more or less my understanding of it as well. It's a talent to take for fights with large amounts of unavoidable damage.
Brisin wrote:
Mastery only comes before haste if you are tank healing more than raid healing or if you are above 2000 and something haste, wich I’m not anyways.
Xsarus mentioned an addon or something that was helping him track what % of his healing was benefiting from mastery, making things more mathy, and less guessing.
One of the things that's pretty hard to answer now (in my mind at least) is at what point you should reforge/etc. to reach a HoT break point. I'd love to see some little doodad that took into account your various spell percentages, the % that benefit from mastery, and math it out with how much of what stats you could reforge to haste and still come out ahead. I imagine it'd be hard though, since the final tick on a HoT would be the one that's most likely to over-heal, and that only compounds the complexity.
That monster in the mirror, he just might be you. -Grover
I wish I had more time in hands to be all mathy and accurate. But, being really honest, I don't and I'm doing all this by perception, really. I tried to regear, reforge and regem and even re-enchant for mastery after I got to a certain point in haste (well, I didn't really did all that, I used that excel thing EJ has for resto druids, TreeCalcs or whatever it's called), but, in the end, I think I prefer a quickier HT/RG than a RJ + whatever that heals for more.
I mean, to gain mastery benefit, I have to already have a HoT on the person, wich seens rather pointless. If someone is really low on health, I will spam HT on him, not cast a RJ and then spam HT. It would be nice if we could actually triage-heal, but, so far, we need everyone with at least 80% health all the time (saved for fights like Chimaeron) or they will pretty much die for AoE or random stuff that should have been interrupted somehow. And I didn't even started to raid Heroics, only Normal for the first 5 bosses on BWD, Halfus and the Council of Wind.
About the Nature Ward, to make a comparison, it's much like Owlkin Frenzy. In some fights, it procs quite some times. In other fights, it never procs. For example, in Chimaeron, it's been really helpfull, in Atramedes it actually saved my butt once and in Halfus, depending on the drakes, it has proven helpfull to me. In other fights, I just dont go below 50% health, unless **** hits the fan and all druids we have in raid (4 in 25 and 2 in 10) cast Tranquility or we wipe, wich makes the Nature Ward pointless anyway. It could, probably, be better if, instead of Rejuvenation, it casted a Regrowth, but it would be OP in PvP, I suppose.
I'm about to try this one today on my 10 man: http://www.wowhead.com/talent#0hbhZMZrfdhbcrzouo
But, again, I don't have any math to support anything I'm saying. It's just perception and my, and my fellow raiders, playstiles and needs.
I mean, to gain mastery benefit, I have to already have a HoT on the person, wich seens rather pointless. If someone is really low on health, I will spam HT on him, not cast a RJ and then spam HT. It would be nice if we could actually triage-heal, but, so far, we need everyone with at least 80% health all the time (saved for fights like Chimaeron) or they will pretty much die for AoE or random stuff that should have been interrupted somehow. And I didn't even started to raid Heroics, only Normal for the first 5 bosses on BWD, Halfus and the Council of Wind.
About the Nature Ward, to make a comparison, it's much like Owlkin Frenzy. In some fights, it procs quite some times. In other fights, it never procs. For example, in Chimaeron, it's been really helpfull, in Atramedes it actually saved my butt once and in Halfus, depending on the drakes, it has proven helpfull to me. In other fights, I just dont go below 50% health, unless **** hits the fan and all druids we have in raid (4 in 25 and 2 in 10) cast Tranquility or we wipe, wich makes the Nature Ward pointless anyway. It could, probably, be better if, instead of Rejuvenation, it casted a Regrowth, but it would be OP in PvP, I suppose.
I'm about to try this one today on my 10 man: http://www.wowhead.com/talent#0hbhZMZrfdhbcrzouo
But, again, I don't have any math to support anything I'm saying. It's just perception and my, and my fellow raiders, playstiles and needs.
Efflorescence, while seeming a bit weak, will easily hit 10% of my healing in group up fights. I'd be leery about giving it up for those fights. I also don't see rejuv spam healing being all that good, and I don't want to have two resto specs, so I've stayed with Efflo for now personally. I also think that the best role for druids right now is tank healing with a spot of raid healing via WG and a few rejuvs. I was dominating healing done on nef using this strategy, which admittedly is an ideal fight for it.
If you are trying a healing style of rejuv spam plus WG then you'll probably find that your mastery gets triggered quite a lot. Going for the 920 haste breakpoint and then going all mastery is godlike in a 10 man, and still useful in a 25 man. I'm not at home, so can't check what addon I'm using, but it's mastery counter or something. It's a mastery addon made only for druids, it's pretty easy to find on google. I'd worry that rejuv spam will mostly just add to your overhealing as everyone else is still working to heal people up, and in most fights aren't going to wait for rejuv to tick through, even at it's new shortened CD.
I would say for a ten man, a druids strongest position is tank healing, and throwing WG out on CD if there is damage. That amounts to a crazy amount of healing, and Mastery makes that much much stronger. Efflorescence is also much better in 10 man especially when combined with WG and mastery. (I'm under the assumption that efflorescence works with mastery) Efflorescence is weird because it will heal for the same amount in a 10 or 25, but because there is so much less other healing going out, it's a higher percent. I don't see Efflo as a great talent or a great spell, but I'm not captivated by the alternative, and it can be helpful, even just as a little bit more healing going out when people are brought super low. here's hoping it gets buffed though.
If you are trying a healing style of rejuv spam plus WG then you'll probably find that your mastery gets triggered quite a lot. Going for the 920 haste breakpoint and then going all mastery is godlike in a 10 man, and still useful in a 25 man. I'm not at home, so can't check what addon I'm using, but it's mastery counter or something. It's a mastery addon made only for druids, it's pretty easy to find on google. I'd worry that rejuv spam will mostly just add to your overhealing as everyone else is still working to heal people up, and in most fights aren't going to wait for rejuv to tick through, even at it's new shortened CD.
I would say for a ten man, a druids strongest position is tank healing, and throwing WG out on CD if there is damage. That amounts to a crazy amount of healing, and Mastery makes that much much stronger. Efflorescence is also much better in 10 man especially when combined with WG and mastery. (I'm under the assumption that efflorescence works with mastery) Efflorescence is weird because it will heal for the same amount in a 10 or 25, but because there is so much less other healing going out, it's a higher percent. I don't see Efflo as a great talent or a great spell, but I'm not captivated by the alternative, and it can be helpful, even just as a little bit more healing going out when people are brought super low. here's hoping it gets buffed though.
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By the way, they're changing the Efflorescence spell effect in 4.1, so perhaps it'll now be a blue circle. No, wait, Resto Shammies got that. Yellow then? No, wait, Holy Priests have that one. Maybe red then. Nope, Death Knights got that.
Maybe the new Efflorescence spell effect will be a huge *** sign popping out of the ground saying "HUG ME OR GDIAF! - literally!"
Maybe the new Efflorescence spell effect will be a huge *** sign popping out of the ground saying "HUG ME OR GDIAF! - literally!"
Please "talk up" if your comprehension white-shifts. I will use simple-happy language-words to help you understand.
I got 6.3% healing from efflo on a bunch of nef kills recently, and I don't chain efflo on that fight.
The question I guess is whether it is worth essentially 6 talent points. Comparing it to what else you can get I'd say yes. You're talking 4% boost to healing from rejuv. Rejuv would have to be over 100%(lol) of your healing to get a 6.3% return. I don't see the other talent points you pick up as really being worth it. The question you have to ask, is do they have a 6% or higher return in healing done. If not, it's probably not worth picking up. For the nef kills I also had 2.9% healing from living seed, so that's actually higher, it's not completely wasted points.
I see it basically as a sucky spell but don't really see the alternatives as being better.
As you get more mana and mana regen I expect people to drop furor and pick up genesis. This boosts rejuv and efflo, which gives you more reason to keep it.
Edited, Feb 24th 2011 3:58pm by Xsarus
The question I guess is whether it is worth essentially 6 talent points. Comparing it to what else you can get I'd say yes. You're talking 4% boost to healing from rejuv. Rejuv would have to be over 100%(lol) of your healing to get a 6.3% return. I don't see the other talent points you pick up as really being worth it. The question you have to ask, is do they have a 6% or higher return in healing done. If not, it's probably not worth picking up. For the nef kills I also had 2.9% healing from living seed, so that's actually higher, it's not completely wasted points.
I see it basically as a sucky spell but don't really see the alternatives as being better.
As you get more mana and mana regen I expect people to drop furor and pick up genesis. This boosts rejuv and efflo, which gives you more reason to keep it.
Edited, Feb 24th 2011 3:58pm by Xsarus
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Quick answer, I promise I will elaborate and post pictures later.
But, if the Druid Mastery addon is correct, Mastery did less than 10% overall healing for me yesterday, when we killed Chimaeron, Atramedes and Conclave of Winds. 10 man version of them. So, no, Rejuv spam dont trigger Mastery that much. Tank healing does, because you ALWAYS have a LB on the tank + you are casting something else on him. Well, at least with my playstile.
Here's the log:
http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/zi5n789wy3yhd457/
I took Screenshots of what the Druid Mastery addon told me for every wipe/kill we did and I always reseted it every fight. Promise I will post them today, still, but later.
About the tank/raid healing discussion...we got a pally, me and a shammy. Pally is the main healer and tank healer. I'm in between OT healer and raid healer, same with the shammy. Some fights he's healing the OT, on others, he's healing the raid. Don't know if you agree with me, but imo pallys are in a better spot for tank healing than us and we are in a better spot for raid healing then they are, though I suppose he could raid heal better than the shammy and, maybe, the shammy could go tank healing? I don't know. What I do know is that, although we are not locked in that setup, we usually go with that because that's what's been working better for us.
My problem with efflorescence is this: Magmnaw it's a good spell to have; Omnitron is ok; BH boss is good to have; Chimaeron is good when the bile-o-tron is down, useless whenever else. And that's it. Useless on council, useless on Maloriak saved for red phase, useless on Atramedes all the time, useless on Halfus. We are trying the 2 dragons today, will have to see if it's usefull or not. Maybe I'm just stuborn since, from the beggining, I said I had no math whatsoever to prove my point, but really, I feel kinda stupid to spend all those talent points in a spell so weak.
Crap I edited instead of quoting. Oops. -Xsarus
Edited, Feb 28th 2011 9:38am by Xsarus
But, if the Druid Mastery addon is correct, Mastery did less than 10% overall healing for me yesterday, when we killed Chimaeron, Atramedes and Conclave of Winds. 10 man version of them. So, no, Rejuv spam dont trigger Mastery that much. Tank healing does, because you ALWAYS have a LB on the tank + you are casting something else on him. Well, at least with my playstile.
Here's the log:
http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/zi5n789wy3yhd457/
I took Screenshots of what the Druid Mastery addon told me for every wipe/kill we did and I always reseted it every fight. Promise I will post them today, still, but later.
About the tank/raid healing discussion...we got a pally, me and a shammy. Pally is the main healer and tank healer. I'm in between OT healer and raid healer, same with the shammy. Some fights he's healing the OT, on others, he's healing the raid. Don't know if you agree with me, but imo pallys are in a better spot for tank healing than us and we are in a better spot for raid healing then they are, though I suppose he could raid heal better than the shammy and, maybe, the shammy could go tank healing? I don't know. What I do know is that, although we are not locked in that setup, we usually go with that because that's what's been working better for us.
My problem with efflorescence is this: Magmnaw it's a good spell to have; Omnitron is ok; BH boss is good to have; Chimaeron is good when the bile-o-tron is down, useless whenever else. And that's it. Useless on council, useless on Maloriak saved for red phase, useless on Atramedes all the time, useless on Halfus. We are trying the 2 dragons today, will have to see if it's usefull or not. Maybe I'm just stuborn since, from the beggining, I said I had no math whatsoever to prove my point, but really, I feel kinda stupid to spend all those talent points in a spell so weak.
Crap I edited instead of quoting. Oops. -Xsarus
Edited, Feb 28th 2011 9:38am by Xsarus
Quote:
Quick answer, I promise I will elaborate and post pictures later.
But, if the Druid Mastery addon is correct, Mastery did less than 10% overall healing for me yesterday, when we killed Chimaeron, Atramedes and Conclave of Winds. 10 man version of them. So, no, Rejuv spam dont trigger Mastery that much. Tank healing does, because you ALWAYS have a LB on the tank + you are casting something else on him. Well, at least with my playstile.
But, if the Druid Mastery addon is correct, Mastery did less than 10% overall healing for me yesterday, when we killed Chimaeron, Atramedes and Conclave of Winds. 10 man version of them. So, no, Rejuv spam dont trigger Mastery that much. Tank healing does, because you ALWAYS have a LB on the tank + you are casting something else on him. Well, at least with my playstile.
Quote:
My problem with efflorescence is this: Magmnaw it's a good spell to have; Omnitron is ok; BH boss is good to have; Chimaeron is good when the bile-o-tron is down, useless whenever else. And that's it. Useless on council, useless on Maloriak saved for red phase, useless on Atramedes all the time, useless on Halfus. We are trying the 2 dragons today, will have to see if it's usefull or not. Maybe I'm just stuborn since, from the beggining, I said I had no math whatsoever to prove my point, but really, I feel kinda stupid to spend all those talent points in a spell so weak.
there we go
Edited, Feb 28th 2011 9:47am by Xsarus
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Damn, forgot to link the screenshots I got. So sorry.
Well, I got back to Efflorescence and Living Seed, because I had to tank heal during the week and I reforged to get some more mastery and a little less haste. And I healed Atramedes with that this past week. Eh...right now, I'm thinking that the difference is really minor with either build in our setup.
May as well keep this build.
About the mastery:
/dm healing - shows the overall healing data table
Though I probably should have gone with
/dm mastery - shows effective mastery healing [no overheals] versus effective total healing [no overheals]
So, yeah, 10% overall healing, but a lot of those are overhealing.
Edited, Feb 28th 2011 3:26pm by Brisin
Well, I got back to Efflorescence and Living Seed, because I had to tank heal during the week and I reforged to get some more mastery and a little less haste. And I healed Atramedes with that this past week. Eh...right now, I'm thinking that the difference is really minor with either build in our setup.
May as well keep this build.
About the mastery:
Quote:
/dm healing - shows the overall healing data table
Though I probably should have gone with
Quote:
/dm mastery - shows effective mastery healing [no overheals] versus effective total healing [no overheals]
So, yeah, 10% overall healing, but a lot of those are overhealing.
Edited, Feb 28th 2011 3:26pm by Brisin
10% is good. Remember that (according to armory) if every single bit of healing you did was affected by mastery you'd get ~18% extra healing. 10% is over half, which to my mind is solid. Certainly better then more haste.
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In other news, I want tree form back (as an actual form). I was healing a lowbie dungeon on my baby druid and it just felt wrong to be in my Worgen form. >:( I'm a druid, dammit, lemme live as a fricken' tree!
IDrownFish wrote:
Anyways, you all are horrible, @#%^ed up people
lolgaxe wrote:
Never underestimate the healing power of a massive dong.
24% overall healing, 5% actual heal not overheal. So...I don't know. Mastery may be not that bad in the end.
Or Druid Mastery addon is wrong, I don't know.
oh, yeah, similar results for 25man Magmaw, Omnitron and Maloriak. 10 man is kinda the same, one or two percents up, wich I didnt expected, actually.
Edited, Mar 1st 2011 10:29pm by Brisin
Or Druid Mastery addon is wrong, I don't know.
oh, yeah, similar results for 25man Magmaw, Omnitron and Maloriak. 10 man is kinda the same, one or two percents up, wich I didnt expected, actually.
Edited, Mar 1st 2011 10:29pm by Brisin
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