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Poison change i would like to seeFollow

#1 Dec 14 2009 at 11:10 AM Rating: Decent
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I think it would be nice if they (blizzard) consolidate crippling with mind numbing poison. Neither do any damage but they both have a slowing effect. In pvp for me personally one blade always has a damaging poison and the other crippling, but to stop in pvp and change crippling to mind numbing and then to have someone else steal your target makes no sense. I just thought i would put this up here in case the ppl from blizzard ever go through the forums here to feel out its user base. Feel free to post your views on this and no i dont think this would be over powered , didn't they do something similar to this with the hunter and his 2 traps and the sham with consolidated totems...just sayin.
#2 Dec 14 2009 at 11:19 AM Rating: Decent
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There is already Deadly Brew. Use this and put Wound on both hands. Every time it procs you get a free crippling poison.

And Muti/Prep is sexy for PvP.
#3 Dec 14 2009 at 11:26 AM Rating: Decent
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Oh that's nice, when I read it again. At the moment im only lvl 37 , but have this talent selected for when I lvl up. On first read i thought it meant if i had cripple on one blade then it would automatically apply it to my target i had no idea it meant that it would apply it even if i didn't have it applied to a weapon... very nice indeed :)
#4 Dec 14 2009 at 12:33 PM Rating: Decent
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Because poisons aren't strong enough? lol

It's horrible balance to let any Rogue (Combat or Subtlety included) to snare and slow every single enemy. If you aren't assassination, you should have to pick your poison (sorry for the pun XD).

Having to choose if you want to focus on a melee snare or a slowing effect is part of the strategy. As a DK, I have to choose if I want to use my runes for damage, or for snares/silences. Same with my RP. We don't have any abilities that do both.

You TECHNICALLY already can use both. You'd just have to give up the damaging poison.

And Shaman totems/Hunter traps are different. Just because 2 effects can be combined to not be OP, doesn't mean ANY 2 effects can.

Shaman totems were fused because it was part of the balance. It boosted them and their groups, yes. But it didn't boost it past breaking point. They're still one of the lower-DpS classes, and their mana efficiency while healing is worse (and the healing harder than Priest/tree healing, though easier than Pally for AoE). This is after the "buff."

Rogues are already very strong competitors. They don't need to be stronger. I don't say this often but, if you are having an issue, L2P. I'm not awesome at DK PvP. Doesn't mean I think I should have my snares and interrupts fused into one ability with a low CD. Now, if I thought that this was actually an issue, I'd agree with you. And you aren't the only class that has to switch things around for casters/melee.
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#5 Dec 14 2009 at 12:53 PM Rating: Decent
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I don't find this to be an issue per say, but i think the change logically makes the most sense, for instance you run up to a mage and hit him with crippling poison... who cares hes not going anywhere hes going to stand in one spot and nuke and AOE like a mad man. What im suggesting is nothing compared to a hunter who can drop a frost trap and a immolation trap use a serpent sting on a melee class and hit the caster with a mana sting all in the same fight all while his pet interrupts the caster nad he pumps arrows into the melee class. Is that not technically the same as what i am asking for? And suggesting a rogue give up the damaging poison is exactly what I don't want to do as a bit of my damage comes out of there. This isn't so much an issue its a request to equalize the playing field :).


Edit, that same hunter is also spamming volley :)

Edited, Dec 14th 2009 2:01pm by nevercrits
#6 Dec 14 2009 at 4:52 PM Rating: Excellent
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It isn't the same at all. You are asking for two highly effective PvP tools to be combined into one, so you don't have to pick and choose (which you don't, you just don't want to).

A hunter has a long CD on Conc. Shot. You have to step in his traps, and the good player will know how to move so as to avoid them. The pets with interrupts are not popular, due to their sub-optimal talents. Mana draining is also mostly a thing of the past. And the ability to put up DoTs is not limited to Hunters.

Furthermore, just because one class has something, doesn't mean every class should. You have the ability to choose either (or both) the crippling and mind-numbing poisons. You have a separate spell-interrupt on top of it (do Rogues get more than one, not counting Gouge?) You can sprint or shadowmeld to fill the gap between enemies. When things are getting rough or you can get the tactical advantage, you can vanish (which NO other class can do). And you have very, very high burst potential. And stuns galore.

You don't need EVERY spec to have access to higher poisoning ability. It just isn't balanced. One can do it, and that's enough.
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IDrownFish wrote:
Anyways, you all are horrible, @#%^ed up people

lolgaxe wrote:
Never underestimate the healing power of a massive dong.
#7 Dec 14 2009 at 7:16 PM Rating: Decent
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idiggory wrote:

Furthermore, just because one class has something, doesn't mean every class should.


Rate up!
#8 Dec 14 2009 at 8:02 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
I don't find this to be an issue per say, but i think the change logically makes the most sense, for instance you run up to a mage and hit him with crippling poison... who cares hes not going anywhere hes going to stand in one spot and nuke and AOE like a mad man. What im suggesting is nothing compared to a hunter who can drop a frost trap and a immolation trap use a serpent sting on a melee class and hit the caster with a mana sting all in the same fight all while his pet interrupts the caster nad he pumps arrows into the melee class. Is that not technically the same as what i am asking for?

No, the same as what you're asking for would quite literally be a hunter who could drop frostfire traps that DOT and slow you at the same time.
#9 Dec 14 2009 at 8:12 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:

No, the same as what you're asking for would quite literally be a hunter who could drop frostfire traps that DOT and slow you at the same time.


Not even. A snare and cast speed reduction would be WAY more annoying than a trap that snared and did a DoT.

Especially considering that BOTH effects are off the GCD, when it takes a hunter 1.5 seconds to place two traps.

This change would basically mean no caster could survive against any Rogue. And even Druids/Pallies would be having way more trouble.

It's probably not THAT big an issue, since most Rogues seem to be Mut even for PvP. But it's still a completely OP, unwarranted change.

The only thing I can imagine the Rogue class needs (as an outsider, granted) is some real AoE ability, which would require a reduction in their single-target damage. The current max expected damage for Rogues with currently available gear is something like 11.xK on bosses. Insane. O.o;;

Personally, I think they should just let poisons have something similar to the Wandering Plague effect that Unholy Death Knights have, and give them splash damage. Though, it couldn't be EXACTLY like WP, as Rogues get insane crit and poisons seem to hit for far more than diseases. Hell, make it a Combat talent. I'm not a player that tends to have problems with one DpS tree having better ST or AoE than another.

[EDIT]

Actually, nvm. I had an idea for a Combat talent that would act like a combination of Wandering Plague and a continuous chain, with a cap, with diminishing chance to enter the next splash event. But it just seems too complicated to code without letting it get ridiculously powerful at high crit levels even on Single-targets, let alone as you add mobs.

[/EDIT]

I know this is a PvP discussion, but I just meant to mention the PvE side as 90% of those changes tend to have a heavy side effect for raiders as well.

Edited, Dec 14th 2009 9:21pm by idiggory
____________________________
IDrownFish wrote:
Anyways, you all are horrible, @#%^ed up people

lolgaxe wrote:
Never underestimate the healing power of a massive dong.
#10 Dec 17 2009 at 8:48 AM Rating: Decent
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53 posts
Just an update, I have now gone into the battle grounds using only mind numbing and crippling poison. What a difference this combination makes, im killing way more Allies then i did before. Im lvl 38 and im following assassination and sub trees, so i cant wait to see what happens to ppl when i get the dangerous brew talent. If your a rogue and you haven't tried this posion combination (mind numbing/ cripple) you should give it a try it works really well in pvp, save the instant and dots for pve. Idiggory I now see that my suggestion may makes us a lil bit to deadly, and that we really should be forced to spend the talent point if we want to have this ability.

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